Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Share your daily McDougall menus and/or keep a journal describing your personal progress.

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Sun Nov 06, 2022 10:08 am

For easy reference, Mark's feedback to me this week in the T&A thread:

Lizzy_F - Saying "NO THANK YOU" to cupcakes is a victory worth celebrating! :D I also want to applaud your honesty and bravery in offering a full accounting of this week and the attendant struggles. Jeff has shared a couple of "(Almost) Instant Soup recipes here and here.
Lizzy_F wrote:
For me, a little always leads to a lot (as it did last night), and I don’t want this to become any sort of regular practice.
I very much identify with this, as is evident from some of my journal entries. It took me a long time to realize it, but for me, NONE is always the better path than "a little." I'm glad you are treating yourself with grace and kindness, and you seem to have processed the causative chain linking this week's challenges in a very thoughtful way. I always tell myself "if hunger isn't the problem, food is not likely to be the solution."
Lizzy_F wrote:
I think oatmeal would have made a better “comfort food” if I really wanted to do that. I don’t usually eat breakfast, so don’t always have oatmeal at the ready in my fridge. Since I’m OK with how it turns out after being frozen, I think I need to keep batch cooked oatmeal ready to go.
I used to do this all the time, and it has proven useful for other participants, as well. I actually really enjoy cold oatmeal, and I would prep several containers with 50/50 oatmeal and fruit to pull right from the refrigerator - I called it my "oatmeal pudding." :) I think your assessment of your "best tools" is spot-on: Accountability, Planning and prepping, and Keeping it simple. In the days when I was struggling, what would most help me get back on track was two-fold: 1. Adopting the mindset that each new meal was an OPPORTUNITY to resume the recommended pattern of behavior (i.e., doing the "next right thing"). 2. Arranging my environment to be in SUPPORT of attaining and maintaining the recommended pattern of behavior. Sometimes after a relapse, for me, that meant taking drastic action (like throwing things in the trash or giving them away). Try to remember, too, that the overall aggregate pattern of behavior we maintain over time determines our results; a digression (or even a detour) doesn't mean our adherence has been ruined, but rather that we will need to "average out" that slip with more adherent behavior going forward into the future (so why don't we go ahead and get started on that?). You will get there. Onward!
Beth

"Long-term sustainable change is what we are really after." ~Jeff Novick
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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Sun Nov 06, 2022 10:10 am

Also for easy reference, Mark's topic to the group for reflection this week (all SO RELEVANT for me!):

In celebration of a new month, new possibilities, and renewed attention and focus, I thought I would share a couple of my old favorites. From my perspective, the two posts linked below serve as useful "companions" to the MWL 10-Point Checklist, coming at things from the angle of behaviors we want to move away from in a fashion complimentary to achieving the recommended behaviors.

JeffN wrote:
Passive Overconsumption: The Unintended Intake of Excess Calories
Jeff Novick, MS, RDN

Have you ever ended up eating more calories than you intended? There are certain properties of food that, when we eat until we are comfortably full, result in the unintended consumption of excess calories. This is called the passive overconsumption of calories. We did not intend to overeat, but we did. Many foods contain several of the following properties that lead to the passive overconsumption of calories. Being aware of these can help us minimize the potential to over consume calories. As you will see, all of these go right along with the principles of calorie density and there is some overlap to them.

Here are 10 factors that lead to the passive overconsumption of calories:

1. Higher Calorie Dense Foods
As the calorie density of the food goes up, we are more likely to overconsume calories, especially as the calorie density goes over 700-1000 calories per pound. On a whole-food, plant-based diet (WFPB), the foods that are over 1000 calories per pound are bread products (breads, bagels, crackers, dry cereals, tortillas), dried/dry fruits, nuts, seeds and oils.

2. Higher Fat Foods
As the percentage of calories from fat goes up, we are more likely to over-consume calories, especially from added fats/oils. Adding fats/oils to food increases the overall percentage of calories from fat and the overall calorie density and decreases the overall satiety (per calorie). On a WFPB diet, the foods that are higher in fat are peanuts, soybeans, avocados, nuts, seeds and oils.

3. Liquid Calories
Liquid calories provide little if any satiety for their calorie load, so they do not fill you up as much as solid foods of equal calories. For example, it is much easier to over consume calories when consuming fruit juice, than the whole fruit. On a WFPB diet, the most common liquid calories are fruit and vegetable juices and non-dairy milks.

4. Added Free Sugars
Added free sugars are high in calorie density and low in satiety. As the percentage of calories from added free sugars in a food goes up, we are more likely to over consume calories. Adding free sugars to food increases the overall calorie density and decreases the overall satiety (per calorie). This includes all added free sugars, even those considered unrefined and/or natural such as maple syrup, molasses, etc.

5. Flour (Bread) Products
Most all flour (bread) products are higher in calorie density and lower in satiety, even if they are made from unrefined whole grains. On a WFPB diet, these foods include bread products (bread, bagels, dry cereal, crackers, tortillas) and baked chips.

6. Dry/Dried Foods
Food that is dried (and/or drier) and low in water have an increased calorie density and tend to be lower in satiety per calorie. On a WFPB diet, the foods that are dried/dry are dried fruits (raisins, prunes), naturally dry fruits (dates), bread products (bread, bagels, dry cereal, crackers, tortillas), baked chips, puffed cereals and popcorn.

7. Emulsifying, Pureeing, & Blending
Blending foods disrupts the fiber and reduces the satiety of the food per calorie, making it easier to overconsume the food. On the other hand, chewing food increases satiety. Examples of blended foods on a WFPB diet include smoothies and dried fruit/nut confections.

8. Hyper-Palatable Foods
These are foods that have been salted, sweetened and/or sauced. They stimulate the appetite and lead to over consumption. Examples include cookies, cakes, pastries, etc.

9. Vanishing Perceived Satiety
Foods that fall into this category appear to be high in satiety due to their large volume but are actually high in calorie density and low in satiety. This is because they are dry foods with their volume coming from air as opposed to water (which decreases calorie density and increases satiety). For example, cooked brown rice (high water content) is 560 calories/lb and brown rice cakes (high air content) are 1760 calories/lb, an over three-fold difference. On a WFPB diet, foods that have vanishing perceived satiety include air-popped popcorn, rice cakes and puffed cereals.

10. Ultra-Processed Foods
Ultra-processed foods tend to be high in fat, calorie density, salt, sugar, refined flours, fat and oil. They also tend to be low in fiber, water and satiety and so we are more likely to over consume calories from them.

If you are having a concern with the overconsumption of calories and managing your weight, greatly limiting and/or eliminating the above foods will help.


JeffN wrote:
Top 10 Reasons for Lack of Success.

1) Poor Adherence/compliance. Sometimes from lack of application and sometimes from lack of understanding of the principles.

2) Misdirection of focus/priorities. Focusing on matters that don't really effect your health while not focusing on the ones that do.

3) Minimizing/Rationalizing the effect of certain behaviors and/or personal preferences, **especially in regard to certain foods**.

4) Too many ultra processed, refined and/or calorie dense foods, especially those that are marketing as being healthy, vegan or plant-based."

5) Not understanding the difference between something that is "not compliant," something that is "allowed" on occasion in small quantities, and something that is "recommended."

6) Inadequate exercise/activity

7) Not planning ahead. If you do not plan ahead for success, you will most likely not find it.

8 ) Time. Healing and results take time and for some of us, it may take a little longer than we hope.

9) Mcdougall "Plus" - This is where you mix the McDougall principles with other principles you have read or learned somewhere else that are not inline with the principles recommended here.

10) Adherence Fatigue - A feeling of fatigue over time for doing what is necessary to maintain compliance to the program (ie, special ordering, meal prep, preparing ahead for social situations). Sometimes, people tire from doing the right thing.
Beth

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby VegSeekingFit » Sun Nov 06, 2022 4:24 pm

Hi Beth,

I am so sorry to hear about the passing of your father-in-law. It sounds like you have had a challenging week.

Also, sounds like you are diligently moving forward --- which is phenomenal!!! :) :-D Mark gave you best advice ever. I know that I have shared before that it took me months (and MONTHS) to really get this "positive self-talk". So critical to following the other steps and just understand how best to handle next choice. Try to frame in mind as a learning experience. Glad that you even said that you forgive yourself!!!! :mrgreen: :-D :D YAY!!!!

Thinking also (just in general) ... we don't live in a world where it is always "natural" to make optimal choices (despite our best intent). Unless we are perfect, it is great to build the skill-set to just re-right the boat when a slip (or whatever we want to call it) may occur.

I love your honesty and "can-do" attitude to get through this.

Image

Glad that we are on this journey together!!! :) :-D I am so inspired by the amazing things that you have achieved .... but especially by how you achieved them!!! (Hard work, laughter, kindness...) Thank you for sharing! You have this 100%!

Best,
Stephanie
"Just put one foot in front of the other and don't worry about the length of the path.
Once you get on that path, and the longer you stay on it, there eventually will come a time when you will not turn back." - Martina Navratilova
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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Mon Nov 07, 2022 11:57 am

Hello journal!!

My husband is back home now which is wonderful. We have been married 25 years. It's funny that we operate in very independent ways, and we give each other a ton of space. We even eat completely different ways now! (I am a 100% McDougaller :D and he is a 100% low carber :mad: ) So different, and yet we are so used to being connected. He never travels due to his business. I sometimes go on vacations alone. After being at home without him this past weekend, I now understand how he says he misses me when I am occassionally gone! A revelation of sorts.

Anyway, it feels AWESOME to be totally back on track with my food. I just posted in Stephanie's journal that I don't log my food. I probably won't log it on the regular. But here is a little logging for today, just to remind myself where I am at this moment in time:

Weight today: 148.4 (how a new low is possible, I don't know. But there you have it. It will bounce up tomorrow)
Current BMI: 21.9
B: Oats w/ cauliflower rice and fruit
L: Broccoli, split pea soup, maybe fruit for dessert, but probably won't be that hungry since I ate breakfast
D: Veg soup, steamed cabbage, baked russets + ketchup, maybe fruit for dessert

I'm meeting a friend for coffee tomorrow that has not seen me since I weighed 218 pounds. I wonder how long it will take him to recognize me. :D

Well, I need to get a move on and get some errands taken care of. McDougall on down the road!
Beth

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Wed Nov 09, 2022 11:56 am

I was just reading one of the "can you really eat as much as you want" threads and just wanted to hang onto this gem from Jeff:

Remember, the program always works because it is based on sound science and the laws of physics.

In Health
Jeff


Saving for posterity!!!!!!
Beth

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Wed Nov 09, 2022 12:15 pm

More Jeff's Gems (I love the simplicity of this - a complete MWL program overview!):

To make it even easier, I can take the numbers completely out and it still makes sense and works.

Eat Freely:
(Foods Low In Calorie Density)
Fruits and veggies

Eat Relatively Large Portions Without Concern:
(Foods Moderate In Calorie Density)
Starchy Veggies, Intact Whole Grains and Legumes

Limit These Foods
(Foods High In Calorie Density)
Breads, Bagels, Dry Cereals, Crackers, Tortilla's, Dried Fruit

Extremely Limit These Foods:
(Foods Very High In Calorie Density)
Nuts, Seeds, OIls, Solid Fats, Junk Foods

The beauty of the principles of calorie density is that it frees us from all these numbers and having to count, portion weigh and/or measure anything. So, don't get caught up in the numbers and for those who do not like numbers, just understand the principle.

For review, here are the basic principles from the same note

Principles of Calorie Density

- Hunger & Satiety
Whenever hungry, eat until you are comfortably full. Don't starve and don't stuff yourself.

- Sequence Your Meals.
Start all meals with a salad, soup and/or fruit

- Don't Drink Your Calories
Avoid liquid calories. Eat/chew your calories, don't drink or liquify them. Liquids have little if any satiety so they do not fill you up as much as solid foods of equal calories.

- Dilution is the Solution: Dilute Out High Calorie Dense Foods/Meals
Dilute the calorie density of your meals by filling 1/2 your plate (by visual volume) with intact whole grains, starchy vegetables and/or legumes and the other half with vegetables and/or fruit.

- Be Aware of the Impact of Vegetables vs Fat/Oil
Vegetables are the lowest in calorie density while fat and oil are the highest. Therefore, adding vegetables to any dish will always lower the overall calorie density of a meal while adding fat and oil will always raise the overall calorie density of a meal

- Limit High Calorie Dense Foods
Limit (or avoid) foods that are higher in calorie density (dried fruit, high fat plant foods, processed whole grains, etc). If you use them, incorporate them into meals that are made up of low calorie dense foods and think of them as a condiment to the meal. For example, add a few slices of avocado added to a large salad, or a few walnuts or raisins added in a bowl of oatmeal and fruit.[/i]

In Health
Jeff
Beth

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby VegSeekingFit » Sun Nov 13, 2022 8:52 pm

Hi Beth! :) :D

Hope that you had an amazing weekend!!!

You saved a lot of great threads here for reference!!! Yay!!! :cool:

Wondering if you dazzled your friend last week?? I am betting you did.

Hope to talk soon.

Take care,
Stephanie
"Just put one foot in front of the other and don't worry about the length of the path.
Once you get on that path, and the longer you stay on it, there eventually will come a time when you will not turn back." - Martina Navratilova
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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Sat Nov 19, 2022 11:48 am

Hi there long neglected journal!!!

And hello Stephanie! Long overdue for a nice big catchup. Mean time, my friend was SHOCKED at the change! He has heart issues and asked me what I've been doing. I gave him the suggestion of the Starch Solution book. That's all I can do.

Based on the T&A group, I have been reading the suggested thread links about compliance. There was a post from f1jim quoted inside one of Jeff's threads that touched me in a profound way. So here it is for my later review and reference:

f1jim wrote:
One must come to terms with the addictive nature of modern "foods" around us. Will power cannot be the only tool in our toolbox. We have to be willing to go through the transition period modern foods require. We have to be willing to go through the psychological battles with family and friends. Chumly has it absolutely perfect. If any of those pieces are not in place we will struggle mightly.
I strongly advise ignoring advice that comes from someone that has been only doing this for a short time. Don't bother with anyone that has been struggling for years and years and is still struggling. They don't have all the pieces in place. Follow those that do no matter how much others will slap you on the back and tell you you are doing great. Just as we don't want food that only satisfies for a few moments but does us harm in the long run, so too it is with dietary advice. Our nutritional gurus should always be those long term leaders like Dr. McDougall, Dr. Esselstyn, Dr. Ornish, Jeff Novick, and many others that have stood the test of time with an unbroken record of success and accomplishment. Much of the advice in our world, yes even here on these boards is highly suspect. This isn't a popularity contest. It's a longevity contest and the winners all have a handful of things in common. Learn those things and eating this way isn't a fight anymore. Anyone that says it is has a few pieces of the puzzle to still put in place.
Making this a lifestyle is our goal. Anything less is making this a lifelong struggle. Want evidence? Study those that have been journaling for years and are still struggling. The truth is if we jump ahead several years they will still be struggling. Why? Don't they want good health and weight? Sure they do. But you have to be willing to do EVERYTHING to make this a permanent lifestyle. A lifestyle that's 24/7. Its everyday of the week, not just Monday through Friday.

Most people won't do that. Most people on these forums won't do that. Only a select number of people are willing to make this their 24/7 lifestyle. Show me your cupboards and shelves. That would be good evidence of a permanent lifestyle change.
Show me where you eat out. That would be good evidence of a lifestyle change.
There is a reason Dr. McDougall lists out how to accomplish this change. Many think they have a better way. Most fool themselves. Some get away with it. Others don't. I can't. The only thing keeping me alive is this way of eating. It's much harder when you don't have that sword hanging over your head but the process is the same for all of us. Live and breath it 24/7 and you will benefit 24/7
okay, I'm down off the soapbox. Return to your regularly scheduled program.
f1jim



For me, this clearly addresses why I cannot afford to start thinking that a little of this or that is "OK." The straight and narrow median in the middle of McDougall Highway is the very best place for me to stay to have the best possible shot at a long and healthy life.
Beth

"Long-term sustainable change is what we are really after." ~Jeff Novick
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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Hjklost55 » Tue Nov 22, 2022 10:55 am

Hello Beth, so very well said….Both your comments and f1jim. I have to totally agree with the “can’t have even ONE bite”…. I am a food addict. And I cannot eat the pleasure trap foods. IN ANY AMOUNT!!! And this is a 24/7 lifestyle.

I do have a question for you. I know you have said you are also a volume eater. As am I. How are you dealing with that and continuing to lose the weight? Any tips or tricks would be greatly appreciated.

I hope you have positively influenced your friend to better health. I have a few of those, but once you share the information, unfortunately it is out of your hands.

Have a great Thanksgiving, and look forward to many more healthy years.
Holly
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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby VegSeekingFit » Tue Nov 22, 2022 11:55 pm

Hi Beth!!! :) :mrgreen: :D

Just want to wish you and your family an AWESOME Thanksgiving. THANK YOU for being an amazing person --- appreciate you a ton!!! I would say "keep going"... but you are flying past!!! :lol:

Cheers,
Stephanie
"Just put one foot in front of the other and don't worry about the length of the path.
Once you get on that path, and the longer you stay on it, there eventually will come a time when you will not turn back." - Martina Navratilova
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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Tue Nov 29, 2022 6:22 pm

Thank you dear Stephanie!!!
Beth

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Sun Dec 04, 2022 9:16 am

Hello journal & McDougalling friends!

Well, I think I am transitioning into maintenance in a more official way now. For now that shift is way more mental than it is about changing anything food wise. I've recently experimented with some food choices that are on the Starch Solution Highway, but outside of the MWL median. I didn't care for the results mentally or on the scale. (almond butter and bread, I'm talking to both of you!!) So I think my best long term strategy is going to be sticking to MWL the vast majority of the time. I also need to be gentle with myself for occassional Starch Solution (but non MWL) choices, because this is just life. Being too rigid and perfectionist with myself has never worked either. So that is the balance I am after on the food front. I am working on some things as reported in the MWL T&A thread about how I plate and sequence my food, just to work on the not getting "stuffed" aspect of my volume eating.

Mentally my "fear of failure" is trying to kick up a notch. I've lost weight plenty of times before, but never managed to KEEP it off. To combat this, I have been spending a little time reading testimonials and so forth of the people (especially the women) who have been successful at this for a long time. I love Esther Loveridge as just one example - love her daily videos and inspiration on her FB page. Her book of daily readings is also inspirational to me. There are also so many women around this forum who I look up to and love reading about. I'm trying to get past that old way of thinking "there is something wrong with me, so it will never work...." There is something wrong with OUR TOXIC FOOD ENVIRONMENT! Not with ME. So there! :D

So for now, my goal weight range is 144 - 149. I have never seen 144 recently, or since I was probably 15 years old LOL. But I've been hovering around 148 - 149 so the goal range (for now - could change) was discussed with Tiffany. This gives me a bit of a framework to evaluate how I am doing connected to my food choices. 144 - 149 equates to a BMI range of 21.3 - 22.0. This seems like a healthy place to be and I will be quite satisfied if everything settles comfortably into this range.

Well, I need to take the dogs out for a potty - part of weekend life at the cabin! (we have a fenced in yard at home, which is MUCH easier especially in the winter!) Brrr....
Beth

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Sat May 13, 2023 5:58 pm

Hello fellow travelers, and hello neglected journal! My goal is to check in here in this journal at least 3 times per week going forward. Someone please hold me accountable to that goal! :)

One year ago today I started my life changing journey - it was the first day of the McDougall 12-Day Program. It has truly changed my life! The follow-up support offered through the program has been invaluable for accountability. I'm so grateful that much of the support continues on. I will continue to participate in the weekly Starchivore group zoom calls for graduates of the program. I will also continue to attend the bi-weekly Dr. McDougall & Mary chats (with Heather facilitating) for 12-Day graduates. I am really going to miss the regular Support Specialist meetings. I can always pick those up again, and have already done extra sessions for the fee, which is very reasonable in my opinion. I seem to be in a pretty good place right now, so I'm going to double down on my activity level here along with the aforementioned support resources, and see how things go.

I continue to strive toward following the MWL guidelines. My biggest challenges at the moment are #9 - eating when hungry, and stopping when satisfied, and #10 - getting 30 minutes a day of walking or other exercise. As a volume eater, I love the feeling of fullness, and really never reach a point of "enough." So I'm still working on that area. As far as exercise goes, I have arthritis and other soft tissues issues that are pretty serious in one of my knees. Sometimes things feel OK for walking and other low impact exercise, and sometimes they don't. I'm seeing an orthopedic doctor and starting PT soon, so we'll see where that goes. There is most likely a knee replacement somewhere out there in my future.

I am sitting at a BMI of 22.5 right now. I am a couple pounds above my goal weight range. So I would like to get my weight down just a little bit. We'll see how that goes as well. I would rather be where I am right now than try anything that might throw me way off track. So it's one day at a time with some experiments around my hunger and fullness issues, and also really concentrating on the other MWL guidelines. It's nice to be at this place in my journey where I don't have any "wiggle room" with compliance because I am at a healthy weight! (referring to Jeff's writing about plateaus and why weight loss gets harder the closer we are to goal).

Well, that's enough for now! A Japanese Sweet Potato is calling my name! :D May year 2 be as magical as year 1!
Last edited by Lizzy_F on Sun May 14, 2023 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Beth

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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Ejeff » Sun May 14, 2023 8:26 am

Congratulations Beth on a fantastic year for you! I am also struggling with stopping eating when full. You have inspired me to try harder on that one. :-D

It’s so wonderful you have found such support through the program. Wishing you great success in year 2.

Erin
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Re: Beyond the 12-Day Program: Beth's Time & Adherence

Postby Lizzy_F » Sun May 14, 2023 1:41 pm

Hi Erin! Thank you so much for your "visit" to my journal and your encouragement! I appreciate knowing that I am not alone with the "stopping when full/satisfied" struggle. Speaking for myself, I suspect this will be a lifelong project!

Just for grins, I estimated my food for the day in Cronometer. I didn't weigh or measure anything, and some of it I haven't even eaten yet - so truly is just a rough estimate. :eek: :eek: :eek: I sure eat a lot of food!! :eek: :eek: :eek: One thing is for sure. If I get better at stopping at "enough," or if someone steals a bunch of my food for the day, I'm still not going to starve, that is for sure! :D :D :D I have added more vegetables to my regimine, which is fine. I have also added more condiments to my typical day, and I'm going to be taking a closer look at that. Some are more calorically dense than I need, and I also want to consider the salt content. (both of those things drive overconsumption, so definitely worth my attention!!) So I will be simplifying what I am doing to see how that goes. I like viewing these things as experiments. I also think that journaling is going to help me just think about what I am doing in a more complete way and better identify issues, opportunities and victories!

My knee is feeling better today, so of course it is raining outside!!! :mad: I'm going to put on my knee brace and do a little beginner rebounding. I'm really enjoying this rebounder on the days when I can do it! I've been following a beginner program through Earth & Owl Youtube channel. The woman who teaches the classes has her 87 year old grandmother on the show to demonstrate that people of all ages and ability levels can do this! So if Grandma Helen can do it, SO CAN I!! :D :D :D
Beth

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